All right, I am pretty sure that some of you are just going to hate on me for what I have to say. Let's get one thing clear here. I HAVE NOTHING AGAINST GAYS, LESBIANS, TRANSSEXUAL PEOPLE AND ANYTHING ELSE SIMILAR THAT COULD BE ADDED TO THIS LIST. If that's what you want to be, clearly, nothing is going to stop you from that. History has proven that. I think it's pretty disgusting and a sin, but I am not going to look down on you for that, nor say that you do not have any rights. Here is my problem with you all...for the most part. YOU ARE WAY TOO SENSITIVE. If you want to be gay, be gay. But realize that not everyone is cool with that. Not everyone will be comfortable with that, either. I know I'm not. I feel as though you cannot say something to people on this list because they are just way too sensitive and look at anything you might say (whether you meant it to be offensive or not) as an insult. Look, I don't hate anyone. But I don't want to walk on eggshells either. Please, just understand that this is a difficult issue and stop trying to silence anything that anyone might say about the matter if it does not agree with you 100%. If you feel uncomfortable because of something someone said to you, you need to take it in stride instead of going to war with them. If you are going to hate on me for saying this, then just pm me. I just feel that as a christian I should be able to say something on this matter. And you, also can say what you want, but we need to be rational about it. And I get the feeling that a lot of you all are not.


Please, prove me wrong.

Okay, so your problem is that they're too sensitive. You want to be proven wrong.

First off, let's look at the fact that LGBT(etc) is a vast category with incredible diversity. To group all of them together and say that they're sensitive is making a big generalization.

If anything, you're speaking about LGBT(etc) activists, which are only a small percentage of LGBT(etc) people (and maybe even a majority of LGBT(etc) activists are straight people). Most of these activists will engage in rational discussion, which I consider different from sensitivity. Some of them won't act rationally, but instead act sensitively. I wouldn't judge them all for that.

When it comes to LGBT(etc) people, many face bullying in schools, and often come home to parents who they can't confide in. Something like 40% of homeless teens are LGBT. Some of these are from parents who kick out their own children after finding out about them. Or they live their whole lives out hiding their inner feelings.

So if I were to generalize about their sensitivity, I would reach the opposite conclusion... that they're generally tougher than the rest of us.

Personally, my own combination of rationality and empathy would stop me from labeling them as "disgusting" (besides for the fact that I don't find them disgusting). I wouldn't be surprised if people don't respond positively to being described in that way. =P

EideticMemory : Understood, but in all of my dealings with them, that's the response that I usually get, so I wasn't aware of the whole picture. And ok, maybe disgusting is a bit strong. (but it's definitly something I'm even comfortable talking about. people will say that's an irrational fear or something like that I guess.) To be honest, here's what I believe. We were all made in the image of GOD, and that includes LGBT (thanks for that abbreviation, didn't know that one.) I just want to be able to deal with them like a rational human being should be able to. And I don't want to feel like walking on eggshells. To be honest, I had to spend a few extra minutes trying to get another word for the phrase besides straight. Just another thing i felt would set someone off.

FaithFighter : If you think you have to walk on eggshells with them, you're being wrong.

Look, LGBT are like everyone else. Some of them are sensitive, some are not, not because they are LGBT, means that they have to be sensitive, or anything else.

If you think you have to walk on eggshells with them, it either means you don't get them, or what you have to say is hurtful. Either way, you need to change your thinking.

And why wouldn't everyone be cool with you being gay/transexual/etc...? Is there anything wrong with that? You make it seem like there is.

Not everyone who fits in the LGBT category are considered to be sensitive. I don't think that they are all way too sensitive especially when they are risking their lives and guts to come clean and be proud of themselves inside out. I definitely agree with EideticMemory about them being tougher than us in general. If they can protest for themselves in order to gain acceptance in society or face any hate that comes in their way, I give them lots of respect. We don't all live the same way nor we live under the same skin and that's what some people don't understand when they are against the LGBT community.

Women are still not equal or close to being equal as men right now after so many centuries but that's a different story. We still have a long way to go if we want our society in general to accept the LGBT community.

Hmm...seen your posts. So basically you are saying that the problem is me? Perhaps. But I don't really know for sure. Well it's not that there is a problem with it, it's just that some people (myself included) find it weird. But then again, I guess that's what they're usually upset about. 

ghostfishy : Really? They take the hate? not in my experience. But perhaps I just haven't seen the kind that you have.
maguc : Apparently, you did not read my post thoroughly, otherwise you would have seen that I consider them like everyone else. I just want them to know that, and not be hurt by any little thing that i might say wrong. That's all. 

FaithFighter : If you do consider them like everyone else, then why did you say this?
"If you want to be gay, be gay. But realize that not everyone is cool with that. Not everyone will be comfortable with that, either. I know I'm not."

If you do treat them like everyone else, why are you not comfortable with that? Why wouldn't everyone be?

maguc : Perhaps it because of the way they are about it. I feel like so many of them. Again the ones i've dealt with, not everyone. Seem so in your face about, to the point of making one uncomfortable. Then they get mad if you say something the least bit offensive to them. Okay, I'll put some blame on me. It's just not easy for me to wrap my head around. It grosses me out. But it's not like I think of them any less as a human being. And that's something I want them to understand. First, my slight apprehension about this issue. It's very tough for me. Second, I still see that they are someone made in the image of GOD, just like me, whether they believe that or not. Is that so hard to understand? "Hey, you gross me out a little, it's a little freaky to me. But bear with me as I try to deal with this, because deep down inside, I can see that you are just like me."

FaithFighter :

At the same time, there are a lot people are quick to call others homophobic. It is like walking on egg-shells, depending on who you're talking to. It can be in-your-face at times. The movement definitely has its moments of imperfection. That can lead to a negative response.

As a whole, though, the movement is about being empathetic and accepting of a group of humans who've been treated terribly throughout history. There's a large history of violence. There's already been five (if not more) transsexual deaths in the US in 2015.

The movement is about stopping those atrocities, and treating others the way we would like to be treated.

I think we can all resonate with that.

EideticMemory : Well, I'm grateful that someone can at least appreciate to some degree my standpoint on this. Basically, I am a human being, I believe in GOD, and even though I believe it's wrong. I want to appreciate their standpoint on it as well, because I believe being compassionate towards them is the way that GOD would have me deal with them. I just want them to know that, and appreciate my standpoint as well.

FaithFighter :

I really respect that standpoint.

You live in a country that supports freedom of speech, you can speak your opinion on the matter, and support anything, at least as an idea.

But, like anything else, your beliefs have backlash, positive and negative.

Also, remember. Pity is the seeds of deception. It has happened, again and again, and again and again.

In the end, I don't really care what other people think. I'm concentrated on serving Yahova, if the Bible says that we should go out openly proclaiming what is sin, you do that.

If the Bible says to win people over with your life, and the way you live it, do that.


I'm not afraid of discussing these topics, though I prefer the people I discuss them with have some stable grounds it all comes from. Just keep a cool head, and by not reacting and playing the emotional game, you can make yourself out to be a much more mature individual that your opponent.

If they call you homophobic, more power too you. Only the immature have to resort to name calling to get the point across, and that move labl's them as such. Don't worry about it. Just remember not to get emotionally involved. Also, talk to people about who will actually listen. Unless your exposing one bad person in front of a crowd, or remembering it as an account to retell, not every person is worth debating, or talking about it too.

Sword legion : Good advice, thanks. Yahova...Is that another spelling for Jehova? 

Here's the trouble with all of this:  You're lumping entire groups of people together without realizing a few fundamentally important things.  The first thing you're skipping is the fact that these are all people.  They're just people, man, and all they want is to be happy and enjoy their lives, just like you.


You posted an thread (a rant?) about how all atheists are too sensitive and take offense over prayer at a meal.  Now you say all non-straight people, in whatever disgusting form they come in, are all too sensitive too.

When you lump entire groups together, you start sounding sexist, racist, homophobic, and worse.

You ask for a rational conversation but when your mind is closed to different ideas, there's no sense in even having a dialogue.  I'm pretty sure Jesus walked around a few thousand years ago and told people to love one another, not call each other names, and if you don't grasp that basic tenant of Christianity, you should reexamine yourself before you start making all these assumptions about entire populations.

There are a lot of nice people who don't consider themselves strictly heterosexual.  And they're a generally welcoming bunch.  They're nurses, firefighters, police, soldiers, and they help others.  Some are good, some are not good, but all are people.  Recognize that and maybe there's a discussion. 

Most importantly, you do have the right to express your opinion and you can say things and not worry about walking on eggshells.  But ask yourself if you have to say them?  What's the importance of walking around and telling "those people" how terrible they are?

Knowledge is knowing something.

Wisdom is knowing when not to say it.

FaithFighter : You know what will always surprise me, dear? The capacity you have to victimize yourself. 

Myelin : *golfclap*

Myelin : Well, you have got me all wrong. I don't preach eternal damnation. Jesus didn't come to the world to condemn it, but to save it. I never called you disgusting. But the idea of that lifestyle just doesn't mix with me. That's what I meant when i said disgusting, it isn't you. If I ever have verbally abused or physically abused anyone for anything. God help me. I  am not that way, because I believe that I was not put here to sit in the judgement seat, but in the servant's seat. To love those around me, no matter what. I'm sorry if I accidentally use a word that are a slur to you. Sometimes those are just the words that I know, as I don't know what is always considered the proper term. Know that I don't mean it. And if I should do it. Correct me, just like before. I don't try to silence anyone. I can't help what you have dealt with other people. They are foolish not to realize, that you are just as they. And while you may see this as a hypocritical statement. I do not think any less of you as a person. It is wrong for you to be denied a job for that. It is wrong to driscriminate (unless of course, you're talking about a bunch of crooks or killers. That might be someone we do not want to help!) But you shouldn't have to hide either. (But on the other hand some are extremely in your face about it.) Executed? You don't have any excuse to be talking like that. How many Christians have been executed over the centuries? Blacks? You can go right down the list. Different groups have been abused  and persecuted at different times, but that is to be expected of the human race. We are imperfect. We all make mistakes, myself just as much as anyone else, including you and any LGTB (I think that's the right term?) I have no need for a hole to hide, by the way. If I wanted to do that, I would never have tried to reach out to all of you through this thread. Finally, I'm not trying to get in your face, but trying to put something out there, so that you can understand me, and I can understand you. That is all. I am sorry that you have been through a lot. And I'm sorry if it seems like I characterize and stereotype. Like I said before. I am imperfect and am prone to make mistakes. But if you're willing to put up with me (sounds like that might be tough) I will do better.

Personally I really do not care if people are gay or not in fact I have a relative who is gay and she is a very nice person so I really don't care if it is sin or not

FaithFighter : What? I didn't accuse you of doing those things, I'm using them as arguments as to why we're not being "sensitive," we have reasons to get angry and upset at people that don't treat us well, because we are perpetually mistreated. Yes, we all make mistakes, but your mentality (at leas the one in the OP) is all about rationalizing them and switching the blame instead of taking responsibility and changing your toxic behavior. And just because others have been mistreated and executed doesn't mean I can't bring it up in a discussion.

Also just because you say you don't look down upon us and think of us as equals doesn't mean that it's true. You literally said we were disgusting, that our "lifestyle" is sinful (i.e. offensive to your God) do you really think that makes you Captain Egalitarian? 

Look, I don't hate you. But I've been hurt so often, and when I point it out I get called "sensitive" a "drama queen" and the very real abuse is ignored. You give this spiel on the LGBT community having to understand and deal with the fact that you're not cool with us, and probably never will be and I'm expected to put up with that, to put on my best smile as I teach you that maybe, just maybe, we deserve respect (don't you dare tell me you are respectful, cause calling an entire group and their "lifestyle" disgusting is the polar opposite of that)

I'm ranting, I'm angry, and I look like the bad guy, I know that. But you've said nothing to warrant my calm or my trust.

Myelin : Look, I'm sorry. Yes, we as Christians believe it to be sinful, but please, let's put that on the back burner for now. I'm sorry that I said the word disgusting. Much like you are now, I was kind of going on a rant, after a couple of our run-ins. But the truth is I really, just run across that a lot. And if you look at my later posts, you will see that I am beginning to understand that a lot of it is me. I say that I live and let live from now on, and just be a nice person. Because that goes so much farther than arguing or making a big deal out of something, as I have done. Once again, I am sorry. And...thanks for putting up with me, I know i can get a little too over the top and fiery and all that. But that's something that's still a work in progress.