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$15 Hour Minimum Wage

 

05-09-16 02:48 PM
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So, this $15 an hour minimum wage was all over the media and it still is. Okay, we all want to make a lot of money to cover living expenses and have something left for pleasure or saving. But, reality is far more complex than that. I've been reading some Forbes articles and from what I've learned in Economics, it seems this $15 an hour is worst than what the advocates for it know. 

Big companies will NOT cut their profits but, rather manipulate their expenses to cover the minimum requirements to stay in business profitably. That means that companies like McDonalds & Wal-Mart will offer self-service- sure some of you have seeing this already. Well, it will become more and more "common". McDonalds alone has implemented 7,000 self servicing kiosks and more to come. Meaning, yes, the $15 an hour minimum wage will happen and yes McDonalds will be so happy to let you know they care about you and will advocate for it. Why? Well the amount of money it takes to get those kiosks become an investment since they save way more long term from having those than paying real people and well machines don't take sick days or vacation; or you know sue you or get worker's compensation. So a company that would hire lets say 15 people; will hire up to 6-8 employees and invest in self servicing machines. 

Meaning that smaller companies will have a greater pool of candidates to choose from. So, they will become more "picky" and if you are not well prepared you're at a loss when competing with a more experienced and educated candidate because minimum wage will not just impact fast food restaurants but, all other businesses as well. 

This leaves the teenagers with less of a chance of acquiring jobs. How are they supposed to have work experience if no one will hire them?

Also, companies will look for cheaper products, ingredients, reduce operating hours, raise menu prices. Is it economics and most importantly greed. Big companies will not reduce their profits and will make arrangements to keep their pockets full so yes, you'll get your money but, you'll likely pay for it in another aspect. The best chances these days are to prepare and educate yourself as much as possible so your worth as an employee is higher and look for hire pay otherwise, you're in a tough market to deal with.

There's no much of a win here unless you're at the top of the chain. Big Companies Don't Lose; They Adapt.
Thoughts on this?

Here are some articles to read more from:

http://www.forbes.com/video/4877634742001/?utm_campaign=Forbes&utm_source=linkedin%20company&utm_medium=social&linkId=24234896

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/03/16/we-are-seeing-the-effects-of-seattles-15-an-hour-minimum-wage/#9fc19be715aa
So, this $15 an hour minimum wage was all over the media and it still is. Okay, we all want to make a lot of money to cover living expenses and have something left for pleasure or saving. But, reality is far more complex than that. I've been reading some Forbes articles and from what I've learned in Economics, it seems this $15 an hour is worst than what the advocates for it know. 

Big companies will NOT cut their profits but, rather manipulate their expenses to cover the minimum requirements to stay in business profitably. That means that companies like McDonalds & Wal-Mart will offer self-service- sure some of you have seeing this already. Well, it will become more and more "common". McDonalds alone has implemented 7,000 self servicing kiosks and more to come. Meaning, yes, the $15 an hour minimum wage will happen and yes McDonalds will be so happy to let you know they care about you and will advocate for it. Why? Well the amount of money it takes to get those kiosks become an investment since they save way more long term from having those than paying real people and well machines don't take sick days or vacation; or you know sue you or get worker's compensation. So a company that would hire lets say 15 people; will hire up to 6-8 employees and invest in self servicing machines. 

Meaning that smaller companies will have a greater pool of candidates to choose from. So, they will become more "picky" and if you are not well prepared you're at a loss when competing with a more experienced and educated candidate because minimum wage will not just impact fast food restaurants but, all other businesses as well. 

This leaves the teenagers with less of a chance of acquiring jobs. How are they supposed to have work experience if no one will hire them?

Also, companies will look for cheaper products, ingredients, reduce operating hours, raise menu prices. Is it economics and most importantly greed. Big companies will not reduce their profits and will make arrangements to keep their pockets full so yes, you'll get your money but, you'll likely pay for it in another aspect. The best chances these days are to prepare and educate yourself as much as possible so your worth as an employee is higher and look for hire pay otherwise, you're in a tough market to deal with.

There's no much of a win here unless you're at the top of the chain. Big Companies Don't Lose; They Adapt.
Thoughts on this?

Here are some articles to read more from:

http://www.forbes.com/video/4877634742001/?utm_campaign=Forbes&utm_source=linkedin%20company&utm_medium=social&linkId=24234896

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/03/16/we-are-seeing-the-effects-of-seattles-15-an-hour-minimum-wage/#9fc19be715aa
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(edited by jlove92 on 05-09-16 03:01 PM)     Post Rating: 6   Liked By: ghostrunner, jnisol, no 8120, Oldschool777, Rasenganfan2, tgags123,

05-09-16 04:31 PM
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Probably you Americans are making a big fuss about this, but being Spanish I must say you're lucky to have such a high wage.

Just working four hours a day, five days a week, it already means $300 a week, more or less $1200 a month. In Spain, the minimum salary is way below $900 A MONTH, and working 8 hours a day, when it's not more than 10. Make a rough calculation to know the hourly wage we have over here and you'll feel a little better for not being Spanish.

Many of us would be happy with $10 an hour, but the bosses of the big companies cannot think beyond their own pockets. They only care for obtaining benefits and being rich. As always, some exceptions exist, but it's a very tiny percentage. Greed has overtaken mankind at all levels.
Probably you Americans are making a big fuss about this, but being Spanish I must say you're lucky to have such a high wage.

Just working four hours a day, five days a week, it already means $300 a week, more or less $1200 a month. In Spain, the minimum salary is way below $900 A MONTH, and working 8 hours a day, when it's not more than 10. Make a rough calculation to know the hourly wage we have over here and you'll feel a little better for not being Spanish.

Many of us would be happy with $10 an hour, but the bosses of the big companies cannot think beyond their own pockets. They only care for obtaining benefits and being rich. As always, some exceptions exist, but it's a very tiny percentage. Greed has overtaken mankind at all levels.
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05-09-16 06:12 PM
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This isn't in effect yet so as of right now you can't make $300/week making minimum wage.  The real problem that we face isn't the rate of the minimum wage.  It's the disparity in income between those at the top and those at the bottom.  Until this gap is closed this problem will plague the country.  I agree with you when you say that the only thing raising the minimum wage will accomplish is the inflation of the dollar making our everyday items more expensive.  However, I do believe things will get worse before they get better.  I myself work in salaried management and companies take full advantage of that too by paying you a decent wage and then working you 60-70 hours a week.  It makes it tough to spend quality time with the family.  Meanwhile since there is no cap on the amount of hours that you can put in as a salaried employee the employer makes you feel like you are stealing from the company if you work less than 50 hours even though you are technically paid for 40.
This isn't in effect yet so as of right now you can't make $300/week making minimum wage.  The real problem that we face isn't the rate of the minimum wage.  It's the disparity in income between those at the top and those at the bottom.  Until this gap is closed this problem will plague the country.  I agree with you when you say that the only thing raising the minimum wage will accomplish is the inflation of the dollar making our everyday items more expensive.  However, I do believe things will get worse before they get better.  I myself work in salaried management and companies take full advantage of that too by paying you a decent wage and then working you 60-70 hours a week.  It makes it tough to spend quality time with the family.  Meanwhile since there is no cap on the amount of hours that you can put in as a salaried employee the employer makes you feel like you are stealing from the company if you work less than 50 hours even though you are technically paid for 40.
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05-09-16 07:38 PM
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The economic theory behind it doesn't back $15/hour.  The value of the work being done isn't worth it.

If everyone got one million dollars, is anyone richer?  That's the real question.  There's simply more money now passing around and that devalues the dollar.  Minimum wage goes up, inflation sets in, and the CPI, the Consumer Price Index, goes up aggressively.  If it costs $15 to have someone stand behind a register while I pump my own gas or to have someone fry up my french fries, I'm suddenly going to not get french fries anymore.  And I'll have to pay way more than what I do now for gas.

The people that get hit the hardest when minimum wage goes up are the folks in the middle.  The middle class gets smacked because we don't get a 100% increase in our wages but every price will go up.  It's too bad.

Econ for the win!
The economic theory behind it doesn't back $15/hour.  The value of the work being done isn't worth it.

If everyone got one million dollars, is anyone richer?  That's the real question.  There's simply more money now passing around and that devalues the dollar.  Minimum wage goes up, inflation sets in, and the CPI, the Consumer Price Index, goes up aggressively.  If it costs $15 to have someone stand behind a register while I pump my own gas or to have someone fry up my french fries, I'm suddenly going to not get french fries anymore.  And I'll have to pay way more than what I do now for gas.

The people that get hit the hardest when minimum wage goes up are the folks in the middle.  The middle class gets smacked because we don't get a 100% increase in our wages but every price will go up.  It's too bad.

Econ for the win!
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05-10-16 02:12 AM
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That whole 15 dollar an hour thing is utter BS. Want to know how companies get around that? They reduce hours and/or let people go. $15 an hour may sound nice,but think about this. With that as the bare minimum,prices of goods and services with go up accordingly. We all lose in this deal. I bet if you gave everyone a bag of gold,some schmucks will complain it is too heavy.
That whole 15 dollar an hour thing is utter BS. Want to know how companies get around that? They reduce hours and/or let people go. $15 an hour may sound nice,but think about this. With that as the bare minimum,prices of goods and services with go up accordingly. We all lose in this deal. I bet if you gave everyone a bag of gold,some schmucks will complain it is too heavy.
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05-11-16 01:43 AM
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I heard somewhere that the price of a big mac would have to go from something like $3.89 to $5.99 to support a fifteen dollar minimum at MacDonald's.  I don't generally buy MacDonald's, but that seems prohibitively expensive for people currently making in the 15-25 dollar wage range.  If the same thing happened across the board with the CPI, I don't know if I could afford it.

Since the last minimum wage increase in 2009, minimum wage workers have enjoyed the some of the highest consumer price index adjusted wages since the early 80s. Workers in 2012 (the most recent data I can find on the Bureau of Labor Statistics web site) enjoyed a higher inflation-adjusted wage than in 33 of the previous 74 years.  In fact, the average CPI adjusted minimum wage since the minimum wage was instituted has been 7.09.  The CPI adjusted wage rate has never come close to 15 dollars. 

Raising a minimum wage also, in a way, hurts lower income workers with few skills.  A business owner can certainly afford to hire an unskilled worker at 7.25 per hour, but must be very selective in choosing a worker at a 15 dollar per hour rate.  The business owner must select someone who can maximize productivity at a 15/hour rate and make capital investments in equipment that helps increase that one worker's productivity at the expense of someone else's job.  We already see entry level jobs going to college graduates.  At 15 dollars an hour, you'd better be hiring college graduates and good luck to anyone else.



 
I heard somewhere that the price of a big mac would have to go from something like $3.89 to $5.99 to support a fifteen dollar minimum at MacDonald's.  I don't generally buy MacDonald's, but that seems prohibitively expensive for people currently making in the 15-25 dollar wage range.  If the same thing happened across the board with the CPI, I don't know if I could afford it.

Since the last minimum wage increase in 2009, minimum wage workers have enjoyed the some of the highest consumer price index adjusted wages since the early 80s. Workers in 2012 (the most recent data I can find on the Bureau of Labor Statistics web site) enjoyed a higher inflation-adjusted wage than in 33 of the previous 74 years.  In fact, the average CPI adjusted minimum wage since the minimum wage was instituted has been 7.09.  The CPI adjusted wage rate has never come close to 15 dollars. 

Raising a minimum wage also, in a way, hurts lower income workers with few skills.  A business owner can certainly afford to hire an unskilled worker at 7.25 per hour, but must be very selective in choosing a worker at a 15 dollar per hour rate.  The business owner must select someone who can maximize productivity at a 15/hour rate and make capital investments in equipment that helps increase that one worker's productivity at the expense of someone else's job.  We already see entry level jobs going to college graduates.  At 15 dollars an hour, you'd better be hiring college graduates and good luck to anyone else.



 
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This basic flaw with $15 an hour is that jobs will disappear,you will see more self service kiosks,and an extreme example was with wartime Germany paying their war debts,they had to print so much money that it was near worthless (they would need a wheelbarrow of marks for a loaf of bread).  I also agree with Dfsg.
This basic flaw with $15 an hour is that jobs will disappear,you will see more self service kiosks,and an extreme example was with wartime Germany paying their war debts,they had to print so much money that it was near worthless (they would need a wheelbarrow of marks for a loaf of bread).  I also agree with Dfsg.
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$15 an hour is nothing more than inflation. It'll hurt people. We ought to teach people how to spend money wisely, not just give them more of it.

My yearly total expenditure for living in downtown Houston is $9000 before school payments. That includes everything. Minimum wage at 40 hours a week would pay me roughly $14,500 before taxes. I could then get all sorts of government help for different things, since I would legally be in poverty.

Minimum wage does not cover single moms with two kids. That's not what it's supposed to cover either. It's not supposed to cover alcohol or weed. It's not supposed to cover pizza. It's not supposed to cover a spacious apartment to yourself. Those are luxury items. What people need to do is learn how to spend.

I have a housemate (21) that lives off his parents still. He eats Ben and Jerry's ice cream most nights, he gets top notch coffee, he eats when and wherever he wants, he works 4 hours on Sunday at his church and has two classes at the community college. This was his first semester (he took 2.5 years before he entered college to figure out what he wanted to enter college for) and then failed both classes. And of course, he's a Sanders fan. He wants Sanders to pay for that college he's failing. It's nuts.

If people spent more on essentials and invested more, they wouldn't stay poor. If the poor stopped living like they were rich, they wouldn't stay so poor. If people weren't financial idiots, they wouldn't be so poor! And regardless what people say, there is at least a tiny trickle-down system. When some of these people start doing better, their neighbor will be benefited as well.

The way to help this country is to work. That's all there is to it. Work, and spend your earnings appropriately.
$15 an hour is nothing more than inflation. It'll hurt people. We ought to teach people how to spend money wisely, not just give them more of it.

My yearly total expenditure for living in downtown Houston is $9000 before school payments. That includes everything. Minimum wage at 40 hours a week would pay me roughly $14,500 before taxes. I could then get all sorts of government help for different things, since I would legally be in poverty.

Minimum wage does not cover single moms with two kids. That's not what it's supposed to cover either. It's not supposed to cover alcohol or weed. It's not supposed to cover pizza. It's not supposed to cover a spacious apartment to yourself. Those are luxury items. What people need to do is learn how to spend.

I have a housemate (21) that lives off his parents still. He eats Ben and Jerry's ice cream most nights, he gets top notch coffee, he eats when and wherever he wants, he works 4 hours on Sunday at his church and has two classes at the community college. This was his first semester (he took 2.5 years before he entered college to figure out what he wanted to enter college for) and then failed both classes. And of course, he's a Sanders fan. He wants Sanders to pay for that college he's failing. It's nuts.

If people spent more on essentials and invested more, they wouldn't stay poor. If the poor stopped living like they were rich, they wouldn't stay so poor. If people weren't financial idiots, they wouldn't be so poor! And regardless what people say, there is at least a tiny trickle-down system. When some of these people start doing better, their neighbor will be benefited as well.

The way to help this country is to work. That's all there is to it. Work, and spend your earnings appropriately.
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As it would seem everyone else has said, I think advocating $15/hr minimum wage is a huge mistake. The argument is that it's not enough to live on, but that's already a flawed argument. Raising the minimum wage right now will be treating a symptom, not addressing the real problem of jobs and proper compensation in the country. I remember in my economics class in high school our teacher told us that even though it's usually a bad idea to do immediate fixed like that, the long term solution is usually the best. But that's another problem because people don't want to wait years for this issue to be resolved, so even if it'll make it worse down the road, they'll advocate higher wages now because the 'now' is what the average person is concerned about.

But I do feel that some jobs should see a tweak in pay, just not minimum wage jobs. Right now I just graduated and I'm on the job hunt. I understand entry level isn't exactly a top-of-the-world position, but most positions seem to only be offering an average of $10/hr. I've seen some crazy job descriptions and responsibilities at that wage, too. How can I move to a place of my own and enter into an actual career when I wouldn't make enough money to do so? At that point it's being treated on par to cashier or something when it should be more than that. 

Anyways, raising the minimum wage wouldn't solve anything. We should address the larger issues with the economy, even if those issues take a while to be fixed. 
As it would seem everyone else has said, I think advocating $15/hr minimum wage is a huge mistake. The argument is that it's not enough to live on, but that's already a flawed argument. Raising the minimum wage right now will be treating a symptom, not addressing the real problem of jobs and proper compensation in the country. I remember in my economics class in high school our teacher told us that even though it's usually a bad idea to do immediate fixed like that, the long term solution is usually the best. But that's another problem because people don't want to wait years for this issue to be resolved, so even if it'll make it worse down the road, they'll advocate higher wages now because the 'now' is what the average person is concerned about.

But I do feel that some jobs should see a tweak in pay, just not minimum wage jobs. Right now I just graduated and I'm on the job hunt. I understand entry level isn't exactly a top-of-the-world position, but most positions seem to only be offering an average of $10/hr. I've seen some crazy job descriptions and responsibilities at that wage, too. How can I move to a place of my own and enter into an actual career when I wouldn't make enough money to do so? At that point it's being treated on par to cashier or something when it should be more than that. 

Anyways, raising the minimum wage wouldn't solve anything. We should address the larger issues with the economy, even if those issues take a while to be fixed. 
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The real minimum wage is $0/h.

Seriously. It's a relic of the progressive age, where people thought they knew how to better society by forcing "undesirables" (often women of minorities) out of the work place or even out of existence with forced sterilization. Minimum was was adopted
explicitely in order to make lower-skilled Black workers unemployed. In fact its purpose is so clear that some presidents have suspended the law in disaster-stricken areas like New Orleans to help the economy.

By pushing for higher minimum wage, advocates are condemning the very people they want to help to misery since their productivity will unlikely match the new salary. 

This meme summarizes minimum wage perfectly: https://cdn.meme.am/instances/250x250/67697432.jpg
The real minimum wage is $0/h.

Seriously. It's a relic of the progressive age, where people thought they knew how to better society by forcing "undesirables" (often women of minorities) out of the work place or even out of existence with forced sterilization. Minimum was was adopted
explicitely in order to make lower-skilled Black workers unemployed. In fact its purpose is so clear that some presidents have suspended the law in disaster-stricken areas like New Orleans to help the economy.

By pushing for higher minimum wage, advocates are condemning the very people they want to help to misery since their productivity will unlikely match the new salary. 

This meme summarizes minimum wage perfectly: https://cdn.meme.am/instances/250x250/67697432.jpg
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